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Saying goodbye is bittersweet

Nine years ago, I launched a podcast with very little certainty that it would thrive. I didn’t know if we would even hit ten episodes. Today I fact-checked my total of 250+ episodes and learned I was WILDLY off. This is technically episode 487.

I would not have been able to continue this long without the incredible generosity of both my guests and my listeners. Without Haley Hatcher of Heart-Centered Podcasting’s support. Without the multiple logos patiently created, and without Emily Hawkins, who composed the dream theme music I wish we’d had from the very beginning.

In this final episode, I am honored that my friend offered to take over the interviewer’s role, letting me reminisce and share the experience of producing this show for so long. Thank you Katherine, I couldn’t have closed this well without you.

The show will be here in the archives for you to revisit, and now we close one chapter. I’m delighted, relieved, exhausted and a bit sad all at once.

Thank you, above all, for listening.

Chapters:

00:53 Katherine May Takes Over
01:29 Reflecting on the Podcast Journey
02:47 Starting the Podcast in 2016
04:05 Early Podcasting Experiences
06:23 Challenges and Changes in Podcasting
08:43 The Evolution of the Podcast
11:03 The Impact of Podcasting on Reading
13:12 Transitioning to Seasonal Formats
18:41 The Future of Podcasting and Writing
28:59 Learning to Set Boundaries in Creative Work
29:30 The Pressure to Constantly Generate Content
31:36 Balancing Creative Work and Personal Well-being
32:11 The Challenges of Social Media for Creators
37:06 The Economics of Podcasting
48:45 The Importance of Boundaries and Self-Protection
55:44 Final Reflections and Gratitude

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Guest interviewer, Katherine May:

Katherine May is an internationally renowned writer, podcaster and speaker whose work touches on nature, spirituality, slow living and neurodivergence. Her hybrid memoir Wintering was a global bestseller, adapted as BBC Radio 4’s Book of the Week, and shortlisted for the Porchlight and Barnes & Noble Book of the Year.

Katherine writes the popular Substack newsletter, The Clearing. Her journalism and essays have appeared in a range of publications including The New York Times, The Observer, The Wall Street Journal, Time, and Aeon.

Katherine lives by the sea in Whitstable, UK, with her husband, son and pets. She loves walking, sea-swimming and cooking enormous feasts.

Connect with Katherine May:

• The Clearing on Substack

• Get Wintering

• Katherine’s other books and offerings

Work with Caroline:

• Work with Caroline 1:1

• Join the next Your Writing Year Intensive

• Learn more about writing courses

Leave a comment

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Creating a cloud in book form

This week, I spoke with the queen of fog, Laura Pashby, a photographer and author with a deep fascination for this ethereal phenomenon. We dive into the inspiration behind Laura's latest book Chasing Fog, discussing her lifelong relationship with fog, its role in her photography and writing, and how it became a central theme in her life and work.

We also look at the broader implications of fog in literature, its emotional and philosophical significance, and the challenges of writing and capturing such an elusive subject. Additionally, our conversation touches on including the personal and memoir elements within the book, Laura's journey to publication, and the reception of her work. As the final interview of the Secret Library, this was a poignant moment, and I was moved by feeling of the show drifting into fog as well.

Chapters:

00:21 Meet Laura Pashby: A Lifelong Bookworm
02:07 The Fascination with Fog
05:16 From Photography to Writing About Fog
08:15 The Journey to Publishing Chasing Fog
12:44 Writing Memoir Elements in a Nonfiction Book
20:33 Fog in Literature and Personal Reflection
23:35 Revisiting Childhood Fears
23:50 Folklore and Fog on Dartmoor
26:07 Climate Change and Fog
29:42 The Process of Writing the Book from a Proposal
32:34 The Emotional Rollercoaster of Book Reviews
35:20 Finding Enchantment in Fog

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About Laura:

Laura Pashby tells stories using words and photographs. She is the author of the narrative non-fiction book Chasing Fog, which is published by Simon & Schuster and was described by Literary Review as ‘a frequently beguiling and thought-provoking book’.

She shares stories with her engaged Instagram following, on her bestselling Substack, and in beautiful magazines.

Connect with Laura Pashby:

• Chasing Fog book

• Small Stories on Substack

• Instagram

Work with Caroline:

• Work with Caroline 1:1

• Join the waitlist for the next Your Writing Year Intensive

• Learn more about writing courses

Leave a comment

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Burnt out to embracing joyous reading + writing

In this episode of The Secret Library Podcast, I am joined by Petya Grady, writer and the creator of on Substack. Petya shares her unique journey from Bulgaria to the US, including her unexpected career transition from academia to UX strategy and social impact startups. Burned out from the corporate world, Petya turned to her love of books to find solace, leading to a fascinating discussion about 'reading and writing kinks.' We explore the psychological allure of reading and writing, how certain themes and settings captivate us, and why it's important to embrace what truly excites us in our literary pursuits. This episode fully embraces the pleasure principles of reading and writing, and I haven’t stopped thinking about it since.

Chapters:

01:26 The Concept of Reading and Writing Kink
04:01 Exploring Pleasure Principles in Literature
07:44 Personal Reading Kinks and Favorite Authors
11:10 The Joy of Recognizing You Personal Reading Fingerprint
17:08 Preferences Regarding Place and Setting in Books
21:35 Cold War Fascination and Spy Stories
22:12 The Bulgarian Umbrella Case
23:55 Surveillance and Spy Devices
24:49 Cold War Literature and Personal Reflections
26:44 The Relevance of Historical Fiction
28:42 When Life and Literature Meet
36:17 Speculative Fiction and Creative Freedom

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About Petya:

Petya K. Grady is the author of A Reading Life, a newsletter exploring books, reading, and the pursuit of intellectual fulfillment. She is currently at work on her first novel, set in Communist-era Bulgaria. Petya lives and writes in Memphis, Tennessee.

Connect with Petya Grady:

• A reading life

• Instagram

Work with Caroline:

• Work with Caroline 1:1

• Join the waitlist for the next Your Writing Year Intensive

• Learn more about writing courses

Leave a comment

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From Chef to Sleuth

In this delicious episode, my guest is Orlando Murrin, a former high-profile food writer who transitioned into the world of mystery writing. After sharing his foundation in food writing, Orlando reveals the pivotal moment when a friend's book deal ignited his own passion for writing mysteries. I learned so much from Orlando, as we discussed his writing process, the creation of his protagonist Paul, editing challenges, and the importance of physical wellness for writers. We also touch on his inspirations, future book ideas, and invaluable advice for aspiring writers. Plus, as you’ll hear, there were multiple laugh-out-lound moments in this one. A must-listen!

Chapters:

01:46 From Food Writer to Mystery Novelist
03:48 The Turning Point: A Friend's Success
06:08 Crafting the Mystery: Character and Plot
12:13 Writing Techniques and Challenges
17:53 Life Lessons and Writing Advice
21:49 Paul's Adventures and Future Plans
24:34 The Joy of Imaginative Writing
25:43 Character Development and Reader Reactions
27:55 Setting and Scene Crafting
30:42 The Writing Process and Plotting
41:29 Physical and Mental Wellness for Writers
46:29 Conclusion and Future Projects

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About Orlando:

After being flung into the culinary limelight as a semi-finalist on Masterchef, Orlando Murrin edited Woman and Home, BBC Good Food and founded Olive magazine; then he switched track to become a chef-hotelier in SW France and Somerset.

He has written six cookbooks and received an Outstanding Achievement Award from the Guild of Food Writers, its highest accolade. A popular guest on TV and radio, and at food and literary festivals, he is also a regular podcaster and podcast host.

From his grandfather, a Met detective who rose to become a crack MI5 interrogator, he inherited a fascination with crime and mystery. He lives in domestic bliss in Exeter, Devon, and has written two culinary crime novels: Knife Skills For Beginners (shortlisted for the McDermid Debut and Crime Fiction Lover Debut Awards) and Murder Below Deck.

Connect with Orlando Murrin:

• Crime Novels

• Cookbooks

• Instagram

Work with Caroline:

• Work with Caroline 1:1

• Join the waitlist for the next Your Writing Year Intensive

• Learn more about writing courses

Leave a comment

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Diving into the Cold

In this episode of the Secret Library Podcast, I speak with Anna Brones from the middle of her current book writing adventure. Anna shares her experiences working on her forthcoming book about cold water practices and communities, inspired by her own cold water swimming routine. We look at the shift in her creative process as she takes on a research-heavy nonfiction book, which is a new direction after her previous titles. She also shares historical and cultural context for cold water immersion. We get into the challenges of balancing different types of creative work and the importance of celebrating small victories along the way. Join us for a fascinating conversation about the intersections of art, writing, and the natural world.

Chapters:

01:40 Anna's Journey: From Cookbooks to Cold Water
03:45 The Concept of Cold: Exploring the New Book
04:32 Cold Water Practice: A Personal Journey
05:33 Building a Cold Water Community
08:41 The Writing Process: Challenges and Insights
10:51 Travel and Research: Immersing in Cold Cultures
15:19 The Creative Process: Embracing the Struggle
19:03 Writing Gnomes: The Magic Behind the Words
21:20 The Unknowable Element of Creativity
22:25 Visual Art vs. Writing: A Creative Comparison
23:54 Balancing Passion and Relaxation
26:47 Victorian Ladies and Cold Water Cures
34:11 The Fluidity of Creative Processes
41:18 Celebrating the Creative Journey

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About Anna:

Anna is a writer, artist, and educator based in the Pacific Northwest. She works as a papercut artist, hand cutting illustrations from single pieces of paper, which have been used everywhere from books to wine labels to public art installations. Passionate about sharing creativity with others, she regularly teaches workshops, both in person and virtually. She is also the author of several books including Fika: The Art of the Swedish Coffee Break, Live Lagom: Balanced Living the Swedish Way, and Best Served Wild: Real Food for Real Adventures. She contributes to a variety of digital and print publications and is currently at work on her forthcoming book Cold: Lessons of Place, Presence, and Practice (2026).

Connect with Anna Brones:

• Anna’s Books

• Creative Fuel Collective

• Creative Fuel on Substack

• Instagram

Work with Caroline:

• Work with Caroline 1:1

• Join the waitlist for the next Your Writing Year Intensive

• Learn more about writing courses

Leave a comment

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Self-Discovery Through Fiction

In this episode, and I explore the nuances of writing fiction versus non-fiction, the significance of intergenerational friendships, and the representation of women in literature, particularly through the lens of the aunt figure. We delve into the themes of self-discovery, chosen family, and the evolution of confidence as women navigate different life stages. The discussion highlights the importance of storytelling in providing alternative narratives and the impact of personal experiences on character development. Emma and I look at the complexities of independence within relationships, the role of friends in self-discovery, and the challenges of the creative process. We share the transformative power of writing in our own lives, sharing the personal growth that comes from completing a novel. Emma talks about her journey of writing her latest book and hints at her upcoming non-fiction project about creativity, emphasizing the importance of community and self-reflection in the creative journey. This is a must listen, and will make you even more excited to read her latest novel, Table for One.

Chapters:

00:10 Meet Emma Gannon: Bestselling Author
00:27 Discussing Emma's New Novel: Table for One
00:35 Fiction vs. Non-Fiction Writing
01:42 Emma's Book Tour and Public Speaking
02:51 Exploring Themes in Table for One
03:07 Character Development and Inspirations
04:40 Generational Perspectives in the Novel
11:53 The Role of Aunts in Literature
19:53 The Journey of Self-Discovery
21:50 Exploring Willow's Relationship Dynamics
23:00 Balancing Independence and Partnership
26:05 The Role of Penn in Willow's Life
28:42 The Struggles and Rewards of Writing
31:17 The Journey of Writing a Novel
37:05 Future Projects and Creativity

About Emma:

Emma Gannon is the Sunday Times bestselling author of 8 books, including Olive, her debut novel, which was nominated for the Dublin Literary Award. Her second novel Table For One publishes in April 2025 with Harper Collins. She runs the popular newsletter The Hyphen and was one of the first in the UK to reach thousands of paid subscriptions on Substack.

Connect with Emma Gannon:

• Get your copy of Table for One

• The Hyphen on Substack

• Instagram

Work with Caroline:

• Work with Caroline 1:1

• Join the waitlist for the next Your Writing Year Intensive

• Learn more about writing courses

Subscribe now

The Scientific Method Meets Writing

In this conversation, Anne-Laure Le Cunff and I discuss the principles behind her book, Tiny Experiments, exploring how small, manageable experiments can transform the writing process. We explore the importance of curiosity, community, and redefining success in creative endeavors. The discussion emphasizes the value of learning in public, the role of experimentation in writing, and how to embrace the creative process without the pressure of perfection. These concepts have profoundly impacted my writing life, and I know they’ll transform yours, too.

Chapters:

00:08 Meet Anne-Laure Le Cunff: Neuroscientist and Author
01:10 The Birth of Tiny Experiments
01:39 The 100 Articles Experiment
02:45 Balancing Creativity and Rest
04:11 From Newsletter to Book: The Journey
07:26 Writing as an Experiment
26:41 The Role of Curiosity in Creativity
29:02 Procrastination and Productivity
33:57 Reflections on Writing and Support
38:24 Conclusion and Final Thoughts

About Anne-Laure:

Anne-Laure Le Cunff is an award-winning neuroscientist and entrepreneur. She is the founder of Ness Labs, where her weekly newsletter is read by more than 100,000 curious minds. Her research at King’s College London focuses on the psychology and neuroscience of lifelong learning, curiosity, and adaptability. Her book, Tiny Experiments, is a transformative guide for living a more experimental life, turning uncertainty into curiosity, and carving a path of self-discovery. Previously, she worked at Google as an executive on digital health projects. Her work has been featured in Rolling Stone, Forbes, Financial Times, WIRED, and more.

Connect with Anne-Laure:

• Get a copy of Tiny Experiments

• Ness Labs

• Instagram

Work with Caroline:

• Work with Caroline 1:1

• Join the waitlist for the next Your Writing Year Intensive

• Learn more about writing courses

Subscribe now

The Pound Project

In this episode, I speak with JP Watson, a writer from Birmingham, UK, and the founder of The Pound Project. This initiative has published and sold thousands of books worldwide. JP shares how his frustration with the publishing industry's limitations led him to create a unique publishing model based on collaboration and sustainability. We discuss the creative and business aspects of crowdfunding and the importance of maintaining creative integrity. JP also reflects on the democratizing power of the internet, the potential impact of AI on the creative industry, and the future of publishing. He emphasizes the need for a symbiotic relationship between big publishing houses and independent models, greater responsibility in social media use, and the importance of encouraging reading among young people. JP also hints at exciting new projects, including a subscription service and a handwritten writing initiative. This episode highlights JP's journey from disappointed writer to entrepreneurial publisher, offering inspiration and practical insights for writers and readers alike.

Chapters:

00:00 Introduction to the Secret Library Podcast
00:21 Meet J.P. Watson and The Pound Project
01:36 The Origin Story of The Pound Project
03:48 Crowdfunding and Publishing Model
06:09 Challenges and Successes in Publishing
10:12 Sustainability and Design in Publishing
16:36 Entrepreneurial Spirit in Writing
25:17 The Future of Publishing and AI
33:27 Encouraging Reading and Writing
42:32 Conclusion and Final Thoughts

Mentioned:

• Tuckey Print, Birmingham

• Enshittification, coined by former SLP guest Cory Doctorow in this article.

• Persephone Books

• The Futurebook Conference, run by The Bookseller

• Burn Before Reading, Daisy Buchanan

Related SLP Episodes:

Book Alchemy

#47 Cory Doctorow on Walkaway and the Future of Publishing

Cory Doctorow not only writes about the future, he's also advocating for a better one in reality…

Listen now

9 years ago · Caroline Donahue

Book Alchemy

Read Yourself Happy with Daisy Buchanan

*This podcast is made possible by the generous support of Book Alchemy’s paid membership. To support the show, please consider upgrading your subscription…

Listen now

a year ago · 21 likes · 1 comment · Caroline Donahue and Daisy Buchanan

About JP:

JP Watson is a writer from Birmingham UK who founded The Pound Project, which has sold thousands of books to more than 100+ countries worldwide.

Connect with JP:

• Get the latest news from The Pound Project

• Instagram: @_pound_project

• March 8th: The Pound Project is hosting a live event with activist and author Gina Martin. Get tickets here, which include her e-book To Hate and Love Men.

Work with Caroline:

• Work with Caroline 1:1

• Join the waitlist for the next Your Writing Year Intensive

• Learn more about writing courses

Subscribe now

Ready to Read Yourself Happy?

In this engaging conversation, Daisy and I explore the profound impact of reading on personal well-being, the joy of rediscovering old favorites, and the importance of embracing diverse reading preferences. We discuss the comfort found in rereading beloved books, the slow reading movement, and how literature can serve as an antidote to anxiety. The conversation also touches on the radical nature of reading for pleasure and the evolving language used in book discussions, culminating in a celebration of the intimate relationship between readers and books.

This conversation could have gone on MUCH longer than we had time for, but I very much hope you have fun eavesdropping on our love fest with books and how not only reading, but rereading has been an instrumental part of our writing education.

Chapters:

00:00 Introduction and Excitement for Reading
03:31 The Joy of Rediscovering Old Books
06:29 Rereading as a Path to Comfort and Craft
09:02 The Importance of Slow Reading
11:21 Reading as an Antidote to Anxiety
18:38 The Role of Books in Understanding Perfection and Vulnerability
26:04 The Quest for True Desires
26:51 Life Lessons from Literature
28:39 Cultural Differences in Literature
29:34 Books to Movies: Anticipation and Adaptation
32:19 The Aesthetic of Book Covers
35:18 Language and Its Evolution
37:46 Reading as a Radical Act
40:23 The Joy of Reading for Pleasure

Books Mentioned:

*to the best of my ability - if we missed any, please ask for details in the comments!

• Read Yourself Happy, Daisy Buchanan

• Expiation, Elizabeth von Arnim

• Enchanted April, Elizabeth von Arnim

• Ballet Shoes, Noel Streatfield

• Invitation to the Waltz, Rosamund Lehmann

• The Motherless Land, Nikki May

• Consider Yourself Kissed, Jessica Stanley

• Wolf Hall, Hilary Mantel (slow read is on )

• Tolstory Together, Yiyun Li

• Bleak House, Charles Dickens

• Middlemarch, George Eliot

• Bridget Jones’ Diary, Helen Fielding

• Swann’s Way, Marcel Proust

• The Guermantes Way, Marcel Proust

• Gone Fishing, Bob Mortimer + Paul Whitehouse

• Beyond Anxiety, Martha Beck

• American Psycho, Brett Easton Ellis

• Alison, Lizzie Stewart

• Rachel’s Holiday, Marian Keyes

• Peter Hujar’s Day, Linda Rosenkrantz

• The Light Years (Cazalet Chronicles), Elizabeth Jane Howard

• Camp! The Story of the Attitude That Conquered the World, Paul Barker

• Rivals, Jilly Cooper

• By Grand Central Station, I Sat Down and Wept, Elizabeth Smart

SLP Episodes mentioned:

Book Alchemy

Soothing Your Nervous System with Sonya Brewer

*To support the show, please visit membership.secretlibrarypodcast.com…

Listen now

2 years ago · 6 likes · Caroline Donahue

About Daisy:

Daisy Buchanan is an award-winning journalist, author and speaker. Her work includes the non-fiction books How To Be A Grown Up and The Sisterhood, and the novels Insatiable, Careering, and Limelight. She regularly contributes to every major UK newspaper and magazine, from the Guardian to Grazia, and the Times radio book show.

She is a TEDx speaker and the host of the chart-topping literary interview podcast You’re Booked, as well as the Daisy Is…podcast series. She appears regularly on TV and radio speaking about everything from pop culture to feminism. Her latest book, Read Yourself Happy, is out now.

Connect with Daisy:

• Get your copy of Read Yourself Happy

• Instagram: @thedaisybee

• Daisy’s Substack: Creative Confidence Clinic

Work with Caroline:

• Work with Caroline 1:1

• Join the waitlist for the next Your Writing Year Intensive

• Learn more about individual course options

For the past two years, I’ve run a challenge every November with a few simple guidelines:

• Mission Prompts arrive every day

• You can choose to accept the mission and write it, or not

• The Mission Prompt self-destructs after we reach midnight around the world

• Write as many days as you like

• No falling behind and no guilt

Writing can be fun!

If you’d like to play around with me this November, join us for Novel Possible.

You can play the daily mission prompts in our substack community, or receive them in a podcast app.

This challenge is available to all paid members of Book Alchemy.

Your mission, should you choose to accept it, is to join us for the third year of Novel possible here:

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So many of us take soul-sucking jobs for a living, while we promise ourselves that we’ll write at night or on the weekends… but years go by and we haven’t made progress, and instead feel defeated and depressed. If you’re in this camp, know that you’re not alone. Sonal Champsee is back on the Secret Library podcast to share her day job tales from software engineering, freelance writing, and real estate before focusing entirely on her own writing career. But more writing time doesn’t necessarily lead to ease and flow. Tune into the full episode to learn how she’s moved through the obstacles in her writing life.

Topics:

• Sonal’s history with engineering, freelance copywriting, and real estate on the search for financial freedom to focus on writing

• The small writing steps that Sonal took to sustain herself while working in jobs she hated

• Struggling with consistency and deadlines as an author when only accountable to yourself

• Handling rejection and finding an editor who really cares and keeps you motivated

• Remembering that uncertainty as a new (and veteran) writer is normal as you cultivate trust and confidence

• What Sonal would tell her younger writing self and the habit she wished she had developed sooner

Resources:

• Sonal’s past ep: Stone Soup: Murky Middle Advice | Sonal Champsee

About Sonal:

Sonal Champsee’s short fiction and essays have been published by magazines such as The New Quarterly, Ricepaper, and Today’s Parent. Her novel-in-progress, Everyone Can’t Be Wrong, was shortlisted for the 2022 UBC/HarperCollins Canada Best New Fiction prize. She was a finalist for the Writer’s Union of Canada’s 2017 Emerging Writers Short Prose contest, and has had a play produced by Prathidhwani Drama Wing in Seattle. Sonal holds an MFA in Creative Writing from UBC, and has studied writers such as with Gail Anderson-Dargatz, Sarah Selecky, Zsuzsi Gartner and Jessica Westhead. She served on the prose editorial board for PRISM International for five years, and is a creative writing instructor for Sarah Selecky’s Writing School. Sonal lives in Toronto.

Connect with Sonal:

• Website

• Instagram: @sonalchampsee

• Subscriber to Sonal's Newsletter

Work with Caroline:

• Work with Caroline 1:1

• Join the waitlist for the Manageable Yet Meaningful Writing Lab

• Learn more about individual course options

I can’t think of anyone more fitting for our penultimate episode of the season than Jacqueline Winspear, a Secret Library veteran and author of 20+ books. Her series, Maisie Dobbs, ends this spring after two decades with the release of The Comfort of Ghosts this spring*.* Throughout our conversation, Jacqueline shares how she knew the series was ready to wrap and what to include in the last book. We discuss what’s next for Jacqueline, and the need to give yourself permission to write the story that keeps calling you. I’m so honored to have Jacqueline on during this special season of her career, and know you’ll find tons of gems in this episode.

Topics:

• How Jacqueline knew her upcoming novel would be the final (and 18th) book in her Maisie Dobbs series

• How to stop plot from overtaking character development, especially through a series

• How to wrap up the last book if you have a big cast

• The different ways Jacqueline explores the impact of war in Maisie Dobbs

• Next books Jacqueline is considering working on.

• The growth that writing memoirs brings and how it can inform fiction writing

• Overcoming being “typecast” as an author to resist being stuck in one lane

Episode Resources:

• Upcoming Maisie Dobbs: The Comfort of Ghosts

• Listen: Jacqueline Winspear | Publishing a Series

• Listen: #144 : Staying Motivated through Dark Places | Jacqueline Winspear

About Jacqueline:

Jacqueline Winspear is the author of eighteen novels in the award-winning, New York Times, National and International bestselling series featuring psychologist-investigator Maisie Dobbs. In addition, Jacqueline’s 2023 non-series novel, The White Lady, was a New York Times and National bestseller, and her 2014 WW1 novel, The Care and Management of Lies, was again a New York Times and National bestseller, as well as a Dayton Literary Peace Prize finalist. Jacqueline has also published two non-fiction books, What Would Maisie Do? and an Edgar-nominated memoir, This Time Next Year We’ll Be Laughing. Jacqueline’s work encompasses essays and journalism covering a wide range of subjects, from women working in wildfire management to articles on international education and social history.

Connect with Jacqueline:

• Website

• Facebook

Work with Caroline:

• Work with Caroline 1:1

• Join the waitlist for the Manageable Yet Meaningful Writing Lab

• Learn more about individual course options

Approaching the topic of money can be hard because it not only brings up feelings of stress, overwhelm, scarcity, and more — but it also can have a massive effect on our nervous system. The good news, though? We can use different techniques to heal and train our nervous system and how we respond to stressful situations. Sonya Brewer, psychotherapist, trauma specialist and relationship expert, joins me today on the Secret Library Podcast. We discuss how she helps people safely engage with money topics so it feels helpful rather than creating more fear and difficulty. This conversation gave me so much relief (and honestly, a bit of excitement) for not only how I face my finances, but how I can actively consider feelings about worth, my work, and my money mindset. If you’re someone who is typically avoidant of all things money, this one is for you.

Topics:

• How Sonya helps people safely engage with money topics without creating more fear and difficulty

• Normalizing the feelings that come up about money and the automatic flight, fight or freeze mode our nervous system can respond with

• Putting your creativity and financial awareness together (by actually creating space) to protect your mental health and your finances

• The Internal Family Systems therapy model and how it can impact how you engage with @ money

• How to productively communicate with your inner critic

• Balancing protecting your dreams with connecting with people who support your dreaming

• Reframing your relationship with fear and knowing that it’s just the price of admission

Episode Resources

• Internal Family Systems by Richard C. Schwartz

About Sonya

Sonya Brewer is a trauma specialist and relationship expert who specializes in creative life and relationship design for overachieving trauma survivors and their partners. She loves helping trauma survivors feel more alive, connected and authentic so they can create the lives and relationships they truly want.

Connect with Sonya

• Badass Boundaries

• Instagram: @sonyabrewersomatics

• Facebook

Work with Caroline:

• Work with Caroline 1:1

• Join the waitlist for the Manageable Yet Meaningful Writing Lab

• Learn more about individual course options

There’s historical fiction, then there’s pre-historical fiction. Judith Lindbergh’s newest book is based in the 5th century BC and she’s masterful at not only researching but connecting the past to her readers today. I’m thrilled to have her on this episode of the Secret Library as she shares her experiences of working with a large traditional publisher, then transferring to a smaller press. Judith is also no stranger to rejection, and she shares how the power of community is the core thing that encouraged her to keep going. Whether you’re wanting to write something that goes against the grain of contemporary fiction, or you are having trouble finding motivation after rejection, there’s so much to learn from this episode. Enjoy!

Topics:

• Judith’s story of getting dropped after a really successful first (published) book and how she overcame this

• Creative ideas for using your advance that isn’t soul sucking and how this has sustained Judith for 15 years

• The value of community as a writer, especially through the lulls and rejections when you want to quit writing

• Judith’s current experience with a smaller press after her first publication with Viking

• How Judith has researched, created, and has begun executing her own book marketing/tour

• Judith’s inspiration for writing about women warriors and a matriarchal culture and how she uses this to drive engagement to her book

• Recognizing the different ways we evolve through our writing and how it impacts the stories we tell

Resources:

• About Akmaral

• Madeline Miller

• Sue Mon Kidd

• The Siberian Ice Maiden

About Judith:

Judith Lindbergh’s new novel, Akmaral, about a nomad woman warrior on the ancient Central Asian steppes, is forthcoming from Regal House Publishing on May 7, 2024. Her debut novel, The Thrall’s Tale, about three women in the first Viking Age settlement in Greenland, was an IndieBound Pick, a Borders Original Voices Selection, and praised by Pulitzer Prize winners Geraldine Brooks and Robert Olen Butler. Her work has appeared in numerous publications including in Newsweek, Zibby Magazine, Next Avenue, Writer’s Digest, Edible Jersey, Literary Mama, Archaeology Magazine, Other Voices, and UP HERE: The North at the Center of the World published by University of Washington Press. She also contributed to the Smithsonian Institution’s exhibition Vikings: The Norse Atlantic Saga and provided expert commentary on two documentary series for The History Channel. Judith received a 2024 Fellowship from the New Jersey State Council on the Arts. She is the Founder/Director of The Writers Circle, a New Jersey-based creative writing center where she teaches aspiring and accomplished writers from ages 8-80.

Connect with Judith:

• Website

• Instagram: @judithlindbergh

• Facebook

Work with Caroline:

• Work with Caroline 1:1

• Join the waitlist for the Manageable Yet Meaningful Writing Lab

• Learn more about individual course options

My guest this week is Carl Richards, who is the author of the One Page Financial Plan: A simple way to be smart about your money, and the Behavior Gap: Simple ways to stop doing dumb things with money. He was also the creator of the Sketch Guy Column, which appeared weekly for a decade in the New York Times. Carl has many other qualifications, but I wanted to include him in this season of the SLP because of his incredible ability to distill concepts down about money, meaning, the ways we interact with money, the ways we support and nurture our creativity by viewing money as another resource, along with our time our effort, our energy — our life force, This conversation had many brain exploding, exciting moments. It was such a joy to speak with Carl, and I'm delighted to share this conversation with you. I think it will surprise you and I can't wait to hear what you think.

Topics:

• Carl’s philosophy when thinking about money and the rift that is currently causing so many problems

• How profit equals permission and allows us to access the things we really care about

• Time, money, energy and attention as the four uses of capital and how to employ them

• Managing the tension of wanting to do something new but feeling too scared

• Learning to be okay with failure and letting it teach you something

• Being intentional with what you want your pinnacle of success or happiness to look like

• Focusing on the pursuit of craft to find enduring happiness

Episode Resources:

• Your Money or Your Life by Vicki Robin

• When Things Fall Apart by Pema Chodron

• 50 Fires Podcast

• So Good They Can’t Ignore You by Cal Newport

About Carl:

Carl Richards is a CERTIFIED FINANCIAL PLANNER™ and the director of investor education for the BAM ALLIANCE, a community of over 130 independent wealth management firms throughout the United States. He is the creator of the weekly Sketch Guy column in the The New York Times, and is a columnist for Morningstar Advisor. Carl has also been featured on Marketplace Money, The Leonard Lopate Show, Oprah.com and Forbes.com. In addition, Carl has become a frequent keynote speaker at financial planning conferences and visual learning events around the world.

Through his simple sketches, Carl makes complex financial concepts easy to understand. His sketches also serve as the foundation for his first book, The Behavior Gap: Simple Ways to Stop Doing Dumb Things with Money (Portfolio/Penguin). Carl’s art appeared in a solo show at the Kimball Art Center, in Park City, Utah. Other showings include The Parson’s Gallery in New York, The Shultz Museum, and an exhibit at the Mansion House in London. His commissioned work is on display in businesses and educational institutions across the country. He lives with his family in Park City, Utah.

Connect with Carl:

• Website

• Behavior Gap Radio

• Instagram: @behaviorgap

Work with Caroline:

• Work with Caroline 1:1

• Join the waitlist for the Manageable Yet Meaningful Writing Lab

• Learn more about individual course options

Summary

My guest this week is Billy Broas. He is the author, along with Tiago Forte, of the forthcoming Simple Marketing for Smart People. Before you panic about the word marketing, hear me out. Billy's created systems to help creative and nerdy people understand marketing, like those of us who write and love books. I’ve studied with Billy to help me get the word out about courses and books at Book Alchemy and the Secret Library. I wanted to share Billy's expertise with you for us to help get your wonderful books in the hands of readers who will enjoy and benefit from them. The first step: they need to know your books exist. Let’s get started with Billy Broas!

Topics:

• How Billy transitioned from brewmaster to marketing consultant and why he chose to write this book

• How today’s approach to email and social media has watered down writing and marketing; learning from old school methods of good storytelling

• How to reach readers without giving up your identity

• The five guiding principles of Billy’s messaging framework

• How being yourself unreservedly helps you find the best readers for your work

• Knowing you aren’t writing your book for to be even clearer in who you want to reach

Episode Resources:

• Building a Second Brain

• The Five Light Bulbs

About Billy:

Bill Broas is an Online Education Growth Expert and the creator of The Five Lightbulbs approach to marketing. Billy is an MBA turned marketing consultant to help online educators and experts reach their ideal students. He’s helped companies in over 40 different niches reach new customers and grow their revenue. Billy’s special focuses are strategy, copywriting, and email marketing.

Connect with Billy:

• Website

• Instagram: @fivelightbulbs

• Facebook

• LinkedIn

Work with Caroline:

• Work with Caroline 1:1

• Join the waitlist for the Manageable Yet Meaningful Writing Lab

• Learn more about individual course options

Today’s episode of the Secret Library is such a treat – we are joined by Erika Rasure, an internationally recognized leader, educator, and researcher in holistic financial wellness. Throughout the episode, we chat about our respective experiences as writers who are also Enneagram 4s and how Erika uses the Enneagram in her work. We discuss the danger of waiting for the “perfect conditions” before starting. We have to be willing to change our conditions from within to take the next step forward. Erika shares why this barrier alone was almost the reason she didn’t write her upcoming book. ( Exciting news: she is now co-authoring it with another SLP guest!) I feel honored to witness such vulnerability from Erika, and know you will learn so much from her sharing. Enjoy!

Topics:

• How Erika found herself in the financial therapy and transformational coaching space, leading to the idea for her book

• Why Erika loves the Enneagram in her work with her clients

• The shame, vulnerability, and innermost thoughts that many authors face when writing (and wanting to make money from it)

• How Erika experienced the loss of motivation in writing and entrepreneurship and how it felt to ask for support

• Finding new solutions when you‘re stuck, including how Erika found the opportunity to co-author

• The importance of internal work to make things happen for you on the outside

Episode Resources:

• The Art of Money Mentorship Program

• Find your Enneagram

About Erika:

Dr. Erika Rasure is an internationally recognized leader, educator, and researcher in holistic financial wellness. For almost two decades, she has practiced financial therapy and coaching. Among her achievements is helping to create National Financial Practice Week, which she is co-founder as Chief Financial Wellness Advisor at Beyond Finance. Dr. Rasure also serves as Chair of the Research Board for the Financial Therapy Clinical Institute. Additionally, she’s a member of the Financial Review Boards for Investopedia, The Balance, VeryWell Family, and VeryWell Parents. Her insight and interviews have been featured in several prestigious national outlets, such as Barron’s, CNN, Forbes, Fox Business, Marketwatch, NBC News Now, USA Today, and Yahoo! She is a Certified Deep Transformational Coach and holds a doctorate in Personal Financial Planning from Kansas State University.

Connect with Erika:

• LinkedIn

Work with Caroline:

• Work with Caroline 1:1

• Join the waitlist for the Manageable Yet Meaningful Writing Lab

• Learn more about individual course options

Thank you!

Since our call for membership to support the production of the Secret Library, we’re up to 11 paid members. Once we have 100 annual memberships, the show’s production is covered for 2024.

Once we reach 100 members, we’ll have a celebration Q+A call. All paid members will be invited to join an Ask Me Anything Zoom AND get a chance to vote on the theme of our next podcast season.

If you’ve been pondering becoming a member, your paid subscription means more than ever right now.

Thank you everyone for your incredible support!

*To support the show, please visit membership.secretlibrarypodcast.com.

Summary:

What if book franchises were as extensive as movie franchises? Would you buy a perfume or a sweater that was curated specifically for your favorite book? Finding new ways to make money as a writer is a theme throughout season 10 and I’m excited to dig deeper with Heidi Fiedler in today’s episode of the Secret Library. Heidi is a writer and editor who has worked on hundreds of children’s books, giving her tons of experience in the publishing world — traditional and indie. We share our hopes for a future where the burden of success is taken off the writer’s back, where the publishing industry is more collaborative and creative. If you’re dreaming about possibilities for the future of publishing, this episode is for you.

Topics:

• What Heidi is currently asking herself about money and writing

• Recent changes that Heidi has noticed with veteran writers asking, “How do I make this work?”

• The disconnect between how many books are being sold and writer income

• Why the idea of “smaller press, smaller money” isn’t necessarily true, plus the pros and cons of smaller advances

• Getting creative with ways writers make money to create an all-encompassing experience

• Patterns Heidi has seen with income for children’s books authors

• Brighter spots of hope for writers to earn more in this day and age

• Why Caroline and Heidi want you to pursue your “what if” idea of a book

Episode Resources:

• Le Labo Fragrances

• Plotting and Writing Suspense Fiction by Patricia Highsmith

• The Sentence by Louise Erdrich

About Heidi:

Writer and editor Heidi Fiedler has worked on hundreds of children’s books for clients ranging from Chronicle to Bravery Magazine. She teaches masterclasses and coaches writers, so they can move forward with confidence and ease. She lives in Massachusetts with her husband, mother, and son.

Connect with Heidi:

• Website

• Instagram: @heidifiedler

Work with Caroline:

• Work with Caroline 1:1

• Join the waitlist for the Manageable Yet Meaningful Writing Lab

• Learn more about individual course options

When I was little, I dreamt of having a radio show on NPR. I even hid in my grandmother’s tiny powder room, which featured a mirror and sink directly opposite the toilet, where I hid and hosted my exclusive show, “Bathroom Talks.”

I can promise you that none of the episodes of the Secret Library were recorded in my bathroom. (However, if any guests want to come forward and admit they were in theirs while we recorded, I would be thrilled to hear this!)

Membership drives

Another part of listening to public radio was the ritual of the membership drive. I remember the hosts calling our for people to help them keep producing content year after year.

Having run the Secret Library almost entirely self-funded for nine years, I know understand how much it costs in time and money to produce a show.

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